Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 20:57:06 -0400
To: WSFA members <WSFAlist at WSFA.org>
From: "Mike B." <omni at omniphile.com>
Subject: [WSFA] Re: rehash of fandom
Reply-To: WSFA members <WSFAlist at WSFA.org>

At 07:20 PM 4/21/05 -0400, Ted White wrote:
>From: "Mike B." <omni at omniphile.com>
>> At 12:14 PM 4/21/05 -0400, Ted White wrote:
>> >From: "Mike B." <omni at omniphile.com>

>> >> You don't have to be primarily a charity group to get seen as one by
>the
>> >> general public, and therefore have some of your odder behaviors
>accepted.
>> <snip>
>> >
>> >I don't think "the general public" sees "bikers" as "primarily a charity
>> >group"
>>
>> Where did anyone say they did?  I said they *didn't* have to be to get
>the
>> attitude benefits from the public.
>
>No, what you said (and I quote directly from above, but *with emphasis*)
>was "You don't have to be primarily a charity group *to get seen* as one by
>the general public."  And I said that bikers *weren't* "seen" that way.

Yes, I see where the confusion is coming from...poor wording on my part.
What I was trying to say was that you don't have to *be* primarily a
charity group...and thus have all the charity work requirements for members
to carry that off...to be seen as a *charitable group* by the general
public, and therefore have some of your odder...etc..  Bikers are often
seen as being very charitable due to some of the things they do, but they
aren't primarily a charity setup in general.  I know the HOGs aren't.

>I called it a "gathering" because it draws bikers (theoretically all
>Vietnam vets) from all over the country.

Yes, they come from all over, but they aren't all Vietnam Vets.  I don't
know if they ever were, but they certainly aren't now.  It's shifted from
being a protest at Congress and the President for doing little or nothing
about POW/MIA issues to being a general show of support for vets and their
issues.

>expressways.  The vast majority of their riders look kinda scruffy and
>Hells-Angelish:  wild and unkept.  And this, I think, reinforces the
>public's image of all bikers:  "Oh, look, Elmer!  Those big ugly bikers are
>here for that parade of theirs.  I hope they don't take over the town -- I
>hear they do things like that."   The fact that Channel 4's Jim Vance is
>one of those bikers doesn't dent the perceptions of such people.

However the show of support that I've seen myself shows that those people
aren't all that make up the public, and I doubt they are even in the
majority.  Those who benefit from the charity activities definitely know
that bikers (the majority of them anyway) are decent people no matter how
they look.  Some of the scruffiest ones I ride with are lawyers, business
owners, programmers, and government manager types, not drug abusers,
rapists and other criminal types.  They have to be neat and tidy and in
uniform 5 days a week, so on their time off they dress how they like and go
for a ride.

If you want to see who I'm talking about, go to http://www.mchog.com/ and
click on the "photo gallery" button.  Here's a really scruffy pair:
http://www.mchog.com/PhotoGallery/2004Pictures/04HogCampTrip2004/04VABeachCa
mp27.JPG

Ok, so maybe we aren't *that* scruffy looking...we'll work on it. ;-)

-- Mike B.
--
"Never look down on anybody unless you're helping him up." -- Rev. Jesse
Jackson