To: WSFAlist at KeithLynch.net
Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2014 20:14:50 -0500
Subject: [WSFA] electrical engineers - the tough reality
From: Ron Kean <ronkean at juno.com>
Reply-To: WSFA members <WSFAlist at KeithLynch.net>

On Sat, 18 Jan 2014 10:25:45 -0500 mark <whitroth at 5-cent.us> writes:
> And you've utterly missed the point: that point being fewer kids are
> going for
> EE because there are fewer jobs in it.

Perhaps I missed that point because it wasn't mentioned in the article.
There may well be 'fewer' American kids going for EE, but the article
seemed to imply that it is still ample for the jobs available - "Claims
of shortages of STEM (science, technology, engineering and math) workers
"have no support in fact and no connection to reality, " Hira said."
That makes sense in line with reports of growing EE unemployment.

The concern which did jump out is (quote) "The fact that these key
occupations are faring worse than the average professional is a bad omen
for the future of U.S. technological superiority," Hira said.

I tend to disagree that the future of American technology is in jeopardy.
 For now, American universities attract tech students from around the
world, and the US is the technological leader, because the best and most
innovative engineers are in the US.  That is not to say that those
engineers are all native born Americans.  Rather, the US attracts
engineers from around the world, who flood in for the economic
opportunity, much as the US continues to attract immigration across the
board.  But especially in engineering, the percentage of foreign born
workers here is high, and the only occupation which comes to mind with a
higher percentage is, perhaps, cab driver.

More fundamentally, it's the free market economic system, along with lack
of corruption, the rule of law, and respect for individual freedom and
property which brings engineers and others to the US, in preference to
some other countries.  Free market pragmatism has been spreading around
the world since the collapse of communism in Europe, resulting in
globalization, and yes, as the market for engineering becomes globalized
by the movement of engineers across borders and the outsourcing of
engineering work by multi-nationals, native born American engineers can
be expected to suffer a drop in real wages relative to the 1980s, when,
for example, the Reagan military buildup provided plentiful well-paying
jobs for American engineers.

The tendency for engineering wages to equalize across the world results
can be a temporary detriment for American engineers, but it's arguably
only relative to the artificial advantages enjoyed by American engineers
in decades past, due to what might be described as trade barriers.  The
trade barriers still exist, but they have been reduced.  Looking at the
big picture, a free market philosophy will produce greater prosperity for
the world as a whole over time, and Americans will be better off in the
long run in a world based on peaceful competition.  If the day comes that
Indian engineers in India are paid more than American engineers in the
US, perhaps some American engineers will complain that they are
underpaid, because they paid less than Indian engineers.

Looking back 500 to 1000 years, India was richer than the West.

As in, the multinationals are
> *dumping*
> (in the exact usage of the "free trade" agreements which allow
> penalization of
> "dumping" goods) the products by taking well-paying jobs from the US
> and
> giving them to underpaid folks elsewhere. (See the news stories this
> past week
> about the Oracle salesman from India who tried to move to the US,
> and wanted
> $60k/yr, and the lawsuit over "$50k/yr's good enough for an
> Indian").
>
> In the mid-eighties, I was salaried, and working on an official
> 37.5hr week.
> By the mid-nineties, it was 40 (or "whatever it takes"), with no o/t,
> no
> "official comp time policy", and so-so benefits (none of this
> "platinum bene
> package" crap.
>
>         mark
>

____________________________________________________________
How to Sleep Like a Rock
Obey this one natural trick to fall asleep and stay asleep all night.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52dc78edfc5778ec0c8bst01vuc